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Online bridge - ajme krivo sam kliknuo...
U toku je Inter City liga koju već nekoliko godina uspješno srijedom na BBO vodi Tonći Radelja iz Splita. Danas se obratio za pomoć oko rješavanja dosta česte sporne situacije:
We lost 9 imps on board 14 when opps would not permit undo. My partner bid 3C over 1N instead of 2C for majors. As a result he played 3HX-2. 2H can make for us. I think board should be scrapped. Opps should also be asked to permit undos when requested.
Ukratko netko je na 1 NT umjesto 2 tref majorskog bikolora licitirao tri tref kao tref baraž. Protivnici nisu prihvatili UNDO. Završili su u 3 herc u kontri dva puta ne gdje se navodno može napraviti.
| West | North | East | South |
| - | - | 1NT | Pass |
| Pass | 3 | Pass | Pass |
| X | 3 | Pass | Pass |
| X | Pass | Pass | Pass |
|  K J 8 6 A Q J 9 7 3 Q 10 8 | |||
| A Q 10 10 6 J 10 8 6 J 6 4 3 | 5 4 3 K 8 4 A K Q 2 K 7 5 | |||
| 9 7 2 5 3 2 9 7 5 4 A 9 2 |
BBO turniri funkcioniraju drukčije nego bridž za stolom. Sam program vam ne dozvoljava napraviti neke pogreške što mi se jako sviđa. Osim kodeksa u upotrebi su i neka online pravila suđenja. Pogledajte prezentaciju Ruia Marquesa : http://cocktailbridge.blog.hr/arhiva-2006-03.html#1620802526 prvi i drugi dio te raspravu na BBO forumu: http://forums.bridgebase.com/index.php?showtopic=16194
Za donijeti odluku o ovom slučaju bitna su dva navoda:
7. Undos
The default setting is for undos to not be used. Some directors prefer to allow undos for bidding and play, or for bidding only. In general, I recommend that undos not be permitted if you desire a more serious tournament setting for several reasons:
(a) Whether an undo is allowed is controlled by the feelings of each pair of opponents, which, in effect, makes each table in your tournament play by a different set of rules. The current director software does not allow a director to undo a player's bid (in accordance with Law 25). In theory, a director can demand that a player undo a bid (and that the player's opponents accept), but the director is required to temporarily activate undos for the entire tournament while this process takes place, which can cause a problem at another table.
(B) Allowing to ask for an undo, through this setting, can also give that player’s partner information to which he or she is not entitled.
Undos are often not requested after a misclick, but rather after a misbid (Why did I not think to bid 3NT a few seconds ago?) or a misplay (I wish I had played this card instead…). It is often impossible for the opponents to know, at the time of the undo request, whether the request is legitimate.
The default setting is for undos to not be used. Some directors prefer to allow undos for bidding and play, or for bidding only. In general, I recommend that undos not be permitted if you desire a more serious tournament setting for several reasons:
(a) Whether an undo is allowed is controlled by the feelings of each pair of opponents, which, in effect, makes each table in your tournament play by a different set of rules. The current director software does not allow a director to undo a player's bid (in accordance with Law 25). In theory, a director can demand that a player undo a bid (and that the player's opponents accept), but the director is required to temporarily activate undos for the entire tournament while this process takes place, which can cause a problem at another table.
(B) Allowing to ask for an undo, through this setting, can also give that player’s partner information to which he or she is not entitled.
Undos are often not requested after a misclick, but rather after a misbid (Why did I not think to bid 3NT a few seconds ago?) or a misplay (I wish I had played this card instead…). It is often impossible for the opponents to know, at the time of the undo request, whether the request is legitimate.
Preporuka je ne koristiti UNDO na BBO turniru. Ako je dozvoljen na milosti se protivnika, tu vam organizator turnira niti može niti smije pomoći. Ako je u pitanju slučajni misclick a UNDO nije dozvoljen trebate odmah tražiti suca turnira i obavijestiti ga o pogrešci kako bi se zaštitili:
38. Misclick during bidding
Occasionally, a player will accidentally click on the wrong bid. Currently, the BBO software does not give the director the capability of canceling a player’s bid. If undos are allowed by the tournament director, of course, the player may request an undo (to the opponents). Both opponents must accept the undo request for the bid to be cancelled. A player may decline or refuse the undo request for any reason, including personal reasons, which is why it seems unfair for a director to select the “undos allowed” option for a tournament.
If undos are not allowed by the tournament director, the player has these options:
A. If the misclicked bid may give a big advantage to the opponent (example, accidentally opening 6h with a weak hand), the player may stop bidding, call the director immediately, and explain the situation. As stated previously, the current BBO software does not allow a director to cancel the bid. The director should cancel the board and adjust the board to ave- for the pair who made the misclicked bid and ave+ for the non-offending pair. This adjustment will also protect the rest of the field.
note: If the player making the misclicked bid does not call the director immediately, the director must not adjust the board in this manner. Otherwise, a player may get a free chance at a good board without a risk of a lower score than ave-.
B. The player may accept the misclicked bid and allow the bidding to continue. In this case, the player must not announce to the table that the bid was a misclick until after the bidding and play are completed. Also, the player is under no obligation to tell the opponents about the misclick. If there is a normally alertable partnership agreement involving the accidental bid, the player must explain the agreement, in private, to the opponents, preferably by clicking on the bid and explaining there. The player is under no obligation to tell the opponents anything more than what partner will think of the bid (their partnership agreement). In this case, the misclicked bid is treated as a psyche bid. If the director requires that psyches be self-reported to the director at the time of the bid, the player should inform the director of the misclick immediately.
Occasionally, a player will accidentally click on the wrong bid. Currently, the BBO software does not give the director the capability of canceling a player’s bid. If undos are allowed by the tournament director, of course, the player may request an undo (to the opponents). Both opponents must accept the undo request for the bid to be cancelled. A player may decline or refuse the undo request for any reason, including personal reasons, which is why it seems unfair for a director to select the “undos allowed” option for a tournament.
If undos are not allowed by the tournament director, the player has these options:
A. If the misclicked bid may give a big advantage to the opponent (example, accidentally opening 6h with a weak hand), the player may stop bidding, call the director immediately, and explain the situation. As stated previously, the current BBO software does not allow a director to cancel the bid. The director should cancel the board and adjust the board to ave- for the pair who made the misclicked bid and ave+ for the non-offending pair. This adjustment will also protect the rest of the field.
note: If the player making the misclicked bid does not call the director immediately, the director must not adjust the board in this manner. Otherwise, a player may get a free chance at a good board without a risk of a lower score than ave-.
B. The player may accept the misclicked bid and allow the bidding to continue. In this case, the player must not announce to the table that the bid was a misclick until after the bidding and play are completed. Also, the player is under no obligation to tell the opponents about the misclick. If there is a normally alertable partnership agreement involving the accidental bid, the player must explain the agreement, in private, to the opponents, preferably by clicking on the bid and explaining there. The player is under no obligation to tell the opponents anything more than what partner will think of the bid (their partnership agreement). In this case, the misclicked bid is treated as a psyche bid. If the director requires that psyches be self-reported to the director at the time of the bid, the player should inform the director of the misclick immediately.
Ovaj zahtjev za stolom je u stvari blef. Tu ne dolazi u obzir nikakvo mjenjanje rezultata i brisanje borda sa meča. Jedino ako se organizator pozove u tijeku licitacije kad se desi misclick može se zadržati pravo na AV- rezultat u slučaju skupe pogreške. Pretpostavljam da to u Inter City ligi nije moguće tako da je dozvoljen UNDO. Međutim protivnici nisu obavezni isti prihvatiti.
Rezultat za stolom ostaje, žalbe nema jer je proceduralna odluka opisana u propozicijama.
Post je objavljen 23.10.2008. u 14:01 sati.